Here is the troubling article of "catholic" Karalen Morthole why she is pro-contraception.
So what else is new?
The Jesuits cannot police their own ranks. I know there are conservative Jesuits. But what are they doing to those who are spreading heresy?
What happened to Ex corde ecclesiae? What happened to those pro-RH Ateneo professors?
I guess they still have a job in the "Catholic" university of Ateneo.
Sorry, ALMS, I had to rant about this.
Homosexual anti-Catholic Danton Remoto and agnostic/anti-Catholic Leloy Claudio still teaches at your university. Wala na ba kayong makuhang iba?!
*still teach
ReplyDeleteI think the Ateneo's being a Catholic university is not diminished when in its pursuit of academic excellence it also respects its professors' differences in opinion.
For one thing, there is nothing inherently anti-Catholic about being homosexual or an agnostic as to be the former is not a choice and therefore not a sin, whereas being the latter can be a demonstration of an honest and humble acknowledgement of the limits of the human mind to grasp the divine.
For another thing, even if one assumes that these two people's thoughts run contrary to the truths preached by the Church, wouldn't it be to the students' benefit to encounter them in a Catholic academic setting so as to better understand why these heretical thoughts are wrong and thus be better prepared to respond to them when encountered outside the classroom?
Pheelyp,
DeleteDanton Remoto is not anti-Catholic because he is gay. He is anti-Catholic because the Church does not agree of his lifestyle. Leloy Claudio came from a family that espouses everything that the Catholic Church abhors. His mother is an abortion advocate! He regularly blogs against the Church.
I have no qualms about letting the students be exposed to this kinds of people. But, my golly, they are teaching these students. To be exposed and to be actually taught is another thing. These two anti-Catholics are teaching students in a Catholic university, how to hate the Catholic Church.
Will you allow your enemy to sit and dine with you and let him tell your relatives or your kids if you have any, how despicable you are and how he plans to kill you?
Far fetched and hypothetical but that is how Remoto and Claudio are working in the Ateneo. And their Jesuit superiors are not doing anything!
Good day,
DeleteI would like to ask what is your basis for these accusations. As far as I know, these teachers are evaluated during every semester for their performance and for the content of the courses that they teach. Also, these people are not admitted into Universities like Ateneo unless they meet a certain standard that would not be in place unless it is approved by the Jesuits themselves.
If you like, please expound your points so that future readers can further understand where you are coming from.
Ventus, I think I made my self clear. The pro-RH professors who came out with their support for the RH Bill is reason enough.
Delete"Also, these people are not admitted into Universities like Ateneo unless they meet a certain standard that would not be in place unless it is approved by the Jesuits themselves." - What standard are they using? Try reading Ex corde ecclesiae.
Even if they justify that they will not bring into their classroom their anti-Catholic tirades, it is reason enough for the administrators of the University not to admit them in the first place since their life's work is against the Church.
We must not put a premium on academic freedom if the souls of the students are at stake here.
I understand your position of these professors being evaluated for their academic competencies. I get you there. We all agree on that point. But about on other areas as well?
As I said in my response above:
Will you allow your enemy to sit and dine with you and let him tell your relatives or your kids if you have any, how despicable you are and how he plans to kill you?
A musician will never and must not teach in a law school. Logic dictates that an enemy of the Catholic Church should not and MUST NOT be employed in a Catholic institution.
You think an INC company would employ Atty. Marwil Llasos who has been defending the Church and attacking the INC?
I would rather have Danton Remoto and Leloy Claudio teaching students about what is wrong with conservative Catholic faith and encouraging their students on how to raise reforms, rather than head-nodding professors who don't know a thing about what they are teaching.
ReplyDeleteOh, and just in case you missed, Benedict XVI had Stephen Hawking, one of the
"anti-creationists" if you may call him, head the Pontifical Academy of the Sciences, and recently had dialogues with feminist thinkers Julia Kristeva. Just in case you missed, Sir Anthony Kenny, a former priest and the leading scholar of Thomas Aquinas (whom the conservatives continually misread in order to propagate their ultra-conservatism that hinders the development of the Church and the many other ways of expressing Christ's love and carrying out His mission to the people of the margins), is in constant discussion with one of evolutionist Richard Dawkins.
I don't think there is nothing wrong with giving these intelligent people the opportunity to share their views in a Catholic university. They have valid points to raise, and who knows, they might spark a reform within the Church, because as we all know, the Church as a people of God should undergo changes (Vatican II has already called for the change in the signs of times, and sadly, a lot of our priests and bishops forgot about it). If these people can make the youth more Catholic than conversative, more universal than close-minded, then they deserve to be in a very good Catholic university.
I suggest that you do a re-reading of "Ex Corde Ecclesiae," because you are missing one crucial point of the Pope (who, as it turns out, acquired his doctorate degree in Philosophy through his dissertation on Jewish philosopher Max Scheler). Quoting from ECE 17:
"In promoting this integration of knowledge, a specific part of a Catholic University's task is to promote dialogue between faith and reason, so that it can be seen more profoundly how faith and reason bear harmonious witness to the unity of all truth."
At the least, how can a Catholic university promote a healthy discourse and dialogue between faith and reason if it does not face the criticisms set against it? How can a healthy discourse occur if a Catholic university, as an institution that is a seat of wisdom in itself, if it will only be defensive and resort to ad hominem argumentation that dismiss the point of any anti-Catholic, rational person is saying.
Tell me, isn't it a violation of the Logos as the Pope described it in ECE? Doesn't it go against the two most recent popes' endeavors toward unity through dialogue?
I hope ECE's conclusion enlightens you about the identity of real Catholic universities, faithful to no master except the Truth, and the Logos made flesh who is Christ:
"he renewal requested of Catholic Universities will make them better able to respond to the task of bringing the message of Christ to man, to society, to the various cultures: "Every human reality, both individual and social has been liberated by Christ: persons, as well as the activities of men and women, of which culture is the highest and incarnate expression. The salvific action of the Church on cultures is achieved, first of all, by means of persons, families and educators... Jesus Christ, our Saviour, offers his light and his hope to all those who promote the sciences, the arts, letters and the numerous fields developed by modem culture."
Earl with your long dissertation about Ex corde ecclesiae, have you even asked how Danton Remoto and Leloy Claudio feels about the Church?
DeleteThere you have it.
Were going in circles and it still ends on the same point.
They are anti-Catholics.
Stephen Hawking IS NOT HEAD of the Pontifical Academy of Sciences. He is a member as such, he is there for dialogue, which is the right thing to do. Not to TEACH in a Catholic university. Check your facts first.
Second, the other people you mentioned are there for dialogue, NOT TO TEACH. There is a great difference my friend.
Lastly, ECE's aim to maintain Catholic universities their CATHOLIC IDENTITY.
“Catholic teaching and discipline are to influence all university activities, while the freedom of conscience of each person is to be fully respected46. Any official action or commitment of the University is to be in accord with its Catholic identity.”
You think rabidly anti-Catholic Remoto and Claudio gives a damn about this? Nah!
If Ateneo does not shape up, they may get a visitation from the Vatican just like the one that happened in Peru.
http://www.zenit.org/article-34335?l=english
Try reading these:
Deletehttp://opinion.inquirer.net/7510/on-the-sweet-insidiousness-of-dialogue
http://dantonremoto2010.blogspot.com/2010/05/catholic-church-hinders-growth-of.html
And here are blog entries from an Ateneo professor and how he thinks of Danton Remoto:
Deletehttp://monkshobbit.wordpress.com/tag/danton-remoto/
I sent you an email about one of remoto's columns,did you get it?
DeleteHere's something good Bishop Antonio might wanna visit and have something done about. Yes, it is a University run by Jesuits and their superior, however, it's Bishop's diocese and according to Ex Corde Ecclesiae,what they are doing is denying and rejecting the facts and the Encyclical and most importantly, orders by the Holy Father. They are denying the Bishop and importantly the Holy Father,which they swore to on their profession of vows...if they still live it. We can only pray my bear brother but a voice (your voice) still speaks out for the truth! Trust me, those "brilliant" students couldn't tell the difference between Reality and Morality.
ReplyDeleteGod bless!
"Danton Remoto is not anti-Catholic because he is gay. He is anti-Catholic because the Church does not agree of his lifestyle."
ReplyDeleteI know a lot of people who claim to be Catholic who's lifestyle the Church does not agree with but I don't see them being labeled as "anti-Catholic." Or are they just not that famous/vocal enough?
"I have no qualms about letting the students be exposed to this kinds of people. But, my golly, they are teaching these students. To be exposed and to be actually taught is another thing. These two anti-Catholics are teaching students in a Catholic university, how to hate the Catholic Church."
I think the idea of "teaching kids anti-Catholic stuff" is a hasty judgment. Have you seen/heard them teach? Do you have data of them inserting "anti-Catholic" lessons along with the academic subjects they actually teach? and for it to be considered "teaching," do they include these "anti-Catholic teachings" in their tests, requirements, or shove it down their throats as facts?
"A musician will never and must not teach in a law school. Logic dictates that an enemy of the Catholic Church should not and MUST NOT be employed in a Catholic institution."
you see music as the enemy of law? cause this is the only way i can see that that sentence would make sense with your whole point. or are you talking about capability? cause i can totally imagine a person with a law doctorate, who is also a musician, teaching at a law school.
Anyway, i'm just first addressing some vagueness in how you present your ideas and how you perceive things. I still have to gather and organize my thoughts regarding so-called "anti-Catholics" not being allowed, or being employed wrongly at Catholic institutions
Oh and by the way, I'd like to think that it's not just the Ateneo that you are trying to be worried about, but the Jesuits in general (you opened up your argument with mentioning them first before the university anyway). Do you have other stories of "anti-Catholics" in other Jesuit institutions, academic or not?
The point in the discourse JPaul is these people have ill will and intent against the Church. It is proven with the articles they write. You cannot expect a Nazi to tell you that whatever he writes in Nazi papers and preaches in Nazi rallies he will not bring into the university and in his classroom. You simply cannot separate it. He will always have ill will against the inferiors.
DeleteThe example about the musician in a law school speaks about the situation where you put someone who has either the best intentions but is not competent to do the job or someone who does not have the competency and does not have the best attitude.
Try asking a parent if he'll allow his toddlers or kids to study under the care of a convicted pedophile.
I think that example is enough.
Who are you to say they are incompetent? They may have a different view regarding what the Church teaches but I really doubt, as said earlier by Ventrus regarding evaluations, that they are incompetent in their field.
DeleteBecause if I follow your logic, a Muslim cannot teach calculus or physics at a Catholic university just because "the Church does not agree with his lifestyle," or because he is perceived as incompetent due to his religious/moral views.
"Try asking a parent if he'll allow his toddlers or kids to study under the care of a convicted pedophile."
Oh Mr. TPC, your example doesn't align with your point, precisely because we are talking about employer-employee, but now you're are talking about employee-client, totally different things! Besides, you are hastily assuming again that all Ateneo students (for example) are Catholic, Christian even, that all parents who send their kids to Catholic schools are after the Catholicism/Christianity. Because my friend, it's not the case.
Oh, JPaul!
DeleteThe whole post is about the Jesuits just looking at the diplomas of Remoto and Claudio, NOT EVEN LOOKING AT THE ILL WILL these people have against the Church.
So, could you please stick to the main point of the blog post and stop looking at the slightest hint of fallacy you could imagine in my response?
The Church will not adapt to one's lifestyle.
DeletePeople should know that these Catholics schools were basically established to teach the Catholic Faith. To teach the religion then other fields follow like science and arts.
The Catholic Teachings should always be the priority. I think these religious administrators of these schools should always realize that.
Btw, I asked whether it's just an Ateneo thing or a Jesuit thing because from what I know, Jesuits had always been liberal and open as compared to their more conservative brothers.
ReplyDeleteCiting this from Wikipedia (sorry, but the article had sources for it): "Within the Catholic Church, there has existed a sometimes tense relationship between Jesuits and the Vatican due to questioning of official Church teaching and papal directives, such as those on abortion,[51][52] birth control,[53][54][55][56] women deacons,[57] homosexuality, and liberation theology.[58][59]"
My point is, the Jesuits had always welcomed these kinds of liberal thinking, even to the point of going against the Vatican itself.
JPaul, Jesuits are known to be highly intellectual. They have always been in a friendly competition with the Dominicans and sometimes the Franciscans with anything theological or even scientific. They have given the world some of the best and sometimes some of the worst. Yup, even Dominicans and Franciscans and other religious orders for that matter.
DeleteBut the Jesuits have always been in the headlines because they have been the most vocal when it comes to expressing their opinion about almost anything the Church says.
Maybe we might see another suppression of the Jesuit Society, this time, not political, but theological. I hope this won't happen to them. I know there are good Jesuits out there. But the bad ones are the ones making the most noise. Ever heard the expression of the noisy empty can?
"But the Jesuits have always been in the headlines because they have been the most vocal when it comes to expressing their opinion about almost anything the Church says."
DeleteIsn't this a good thing? People from inside questioning the authority of which he is part of? Not to destroy it but to make it better? Al I'm saying is questioning is good, even though it sparks controversy. As intellectuals (as you've said), it's only normal to question anything and everything, even the status quo, even the pope, but not to discredit them or rebel against them, but for a better understanding of the world. Isn't that more noble than just (blindly) accepting things other people tell you? without discernment and contemplation?
"People from inside questioning the authority of which he is part of? Not to destroy it but to make it better?"
DeleteDogma CANNOT BE MADE BETTER, unless you did not know that.
Those people who "question authority" are not questioning authority. They are questioning the belief of the Church which has been the same time and again. How many Jesuits have said that Church teaching on contraception and abortion only began with Humanae Vitae? I don't have the exact numbers but they always say the exact same thing. They haven't even read HV. Paul VI just affirmed what has been taught by the Church through the ages.
Study your catechism first. Obviously you are either someone posing as a Catholic or a Catholic who is completely confused. If your Atenean, look for the Ateno Latin Mass Society or for Dr. Quirino Sugon. He can help you. If you are from another school, send me an email pinoycatholic@gmail.com. I'll help you.
So are you justifying that because not all of the Ateneans are not Catholic, it does not mean that this Catholic University, or not anymore Catholic because of it Dissident faculty, not to take the stand of the Church. Reminds me of Joaquin Bernas, yes his name no Fr he does not act like one. Now your getting your @SS downhill. With respect also, i know some very good Jesuits. They have even some Priest and even Bishops in the Eastern Rite, so i think it will be unfair if the whole Congregation will be dispersed because of its bad yolk, and i refer that to the bad Jesuits you try to defend hard :P
DeleteEx Corde Ecclesiae, or much worse, the Repeat Performance of 1767. The Society of Jesus are free to choose which of which
ReplyDeleteATENEO DE MANILA UNIVERSITY, A CATHOLIC SCHOOL PRODUCING HERETICS AND ENEMIES OF THE HOLY MOTHER CHURCH. I will mentioned the two famous ones: JOSE RIZAL and BENIGNO SIMEON AQUINO III. Pueblo amante de Maria infested by this People who demonized the Church
DeleteWe are all bound to accept the teaching of the Magisterium, whether it is extraordinary or ordinary, that is Canon law 750: "Those things are to be believed by divine and catholic faith which are contained in the word of God as it has been written or handed down by tradition, that is, in the single deposit of faith entrusted to the Church, and which are at the same time proposed as divinely revealed either by the solemn Magisterium of the Church, or by its ordinary and universal Magisterium, which in fact is manifested by the common adherence of Christ’s faithful under the guidance of the sacred Magisterium. All are therefore bound to avoid any contrary doctrines." HV is certainly part of the ordinary Magisterium. Should Rome decide to suppress them again, it's fine with me.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/motu_proprio/documents/hf_jp-ii_motu-proprio_30061998_ad-tuendam-fidem_en.html
You seem to be clouded by your emotions against anti-Catholics. Doesn't it sound hypocritical that instead of encouraging them to be believers like you (something I believe Jesus would have done), you waste your blog space to label these people to terms that are similar to sinners in the Christian religion?
ReplyDeleteLooks like you have to check your facts also, The Pinoy Catholic. Here are some of Danton Remoto's feedback to this post:
(March 3 at 12:14am) In my radio show REMOTO CONTROL yesterday, I read the press release from CBCP about their online Visita Iglesia. I also talked about events related to Lent. If I am anti-Catholic church, would I give them the time of day? I already retired from Ateneo. I only teach part-time because we need more Literature teachers. So sa echoserang palaka na nag post nito, check your facts first, mangmang!
(March 5 at 12:27pm) I forgot to say this: I pray pala fervently in the Church of the Pentecost, my eyelids fluttering, so that my Pinoy Catholic enemies will not see the light.
Peter Benjamin, Danton Remoto is pro-gay marriage and pro-contraception which are against the Natural Law and He always accuses the Catholic hierarchy of being biased against the Church.
DeleteNow you call that being faithful?
Tell Remoto to email me.